Curse

Greentongue · May 20, 2005, 12:39 PM // 12:39

An annoying thing is that Guild Members do not enter the same District when "Mapping" to a new location. I believe that each Guild should have its own default District based on the first member to arrive. (Multiple Guilds per District of course.)

Whenever you map, you would always start in the same default district as the first Guild member to occupy the map location.

dinglenut · May 20, 2005, 12:41 PM // 12:41

I like this idea, I'm bumping due to the lack of bumpage on good ideas and the continued posting on the not so good ones.

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 12:54 PM // 12:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greentongue

An annoying thing is that Guild Members do not enter the same District when "Mapping" to a new location. I believe that each Guild should have its own default District based on the first member to arrive. (Multiple Guilds per District of course.)

Whenever you map, you would always start in the same default district as the first Guild member to occupy the map location.

I'd agree with you except for the fact that this would HUGELY increase server load. Could you imagine trying to keep track of thousands of guilds, that's thousands of check statements. Think that'd be a bit much just for guilds. The current implementation lets you travel instantly and it only takes 2-3 seconds to switch districts. While there is room for improvement I think this is a bit over the top. My opinion though.

RTSFirebat · May 20, 2005, 12:54 PM // 12:54

"Bumpage" is not a word

Anyways I do like this idea, basically.

IF Guild_District # is NOT full, THEN enter Guild_District #
ELSE Enter next one up.

something like that. Would be handy to keep guild groups together.

As for server load, don't think it will be that much, servers are more powerful the most people give them credit for.

Simply the server will have to check if the District has a space, its only a matter of checking a number against the player's guild.

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 01:00 PM // 13:00

Yeh checking thousands time a second, I work in data storage. It's not the servers, its the connection to them. Having to do this for every instance someone enters a town/outpost would increase unneeded load. Already see lag, no reason to make more. Just wanted to add, that servers are normal PC's, nothing more nothing less (except memory, drive space, and maybe # of processors). For the usual case.

RTSFirebat · May 20, 2005, 01:02 PM // 13:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnCoke

Yeh checking thousands time a second, I work in data storage. It's not the servers, its the connection to them. Having to do this for every instance someone enters a town/outpost would increase unneeded load. Already see lag, no reason to make more. Just wanted to add, that servers are normal PC's, nothing more nothing less (except memory, drive space, and maybe # of processors). For the usual case.

I beg to differ from the servers with use here at IBM UK

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 01:06 PM // 13:06

Considering we make your data storage, if you're referring to IBM. We make most of your controllers/drive tray arrays. I'm the guy who tests the next line of products for you... the ones you aren't using. I'll PM you my phone number if you want and we can discuss this. Not going to post it though. It's Friday and I'm bored at work.

RTSFirebat · May 20, 2005, 01:12 PM // 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnCoke

Considering we make your data storage, if you're referring to IBM. We make most of your controllers/drive tray arrays. I'm the guy who tests the next line of products for you... the ones you aren't using. I'll PM you my phone number if you want and we can discuss this. Not going to post it though. It's Friday and I'm bored at work.

Can't be asked to discuss the matter anymore Mr.Ego, and no I don't want your number

In any case not my fault if A.Net cannot afford to invest in better data storage methods.

Then again this game is free-2-play and I'm sure they most likely never will.

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 01:20 PM // 13:20

Wow. Said I was bored and now I have an ego. Your the one who wanted to debate over the power of servers? Now you opt out blaming Anet? Alright, thats fine but don't criticize me for telling the truth. And once again, it's not they're data storage, its not they're servers (mostly), its they're connection and the packets sent over it. Having to check every single time someone enters will increase unneeded traffic. Period.

Kopus Tol · May 20, 2005, 03:32 PM // 15:32

I don't see how this would massively increase traffic. A member in a guild enters a town, and that member's client asks the clients of the other members where they are. Compare this to: A member in a guild enters a town, and uses guild chat to ask what district the other guild members are in. It looks like the same amount of traffic to me.

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 04:28 PM // 16:28

It may seem that way but it isn't. The traffic HAS to go through the server connection first. Chat..pfft. That's no traffic. But doing If statements isn't much, except multiply it by the number of characters and then you have a search function to look for the guild members in a guild list up to 100. Yeh, traffic. And it's unneded "in my opinion". Argue with it if you want, but there is an increase in traffic. I never said massive. Stop putting words in my mouth. As the game's connection is already obviously stressed a little, anything more that isn't needed I'd suggest against. No matter what it is.

Kopus Tol · May 20, 2005, 04:44 PM // 16:44

Doing guild chat is no traffic? You have no idea what you're talking about.

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 04:46 PM // 16:46

Sorry, little traffic. You read into my words literally

. Its nothing compared to this addition. Or ARE YOU going to argue that ASCII characters take up massive amounts of traffic?

Kopus Tol · May 20, 2005, 04:53 PM // 16:53

Since you admit that guild chat takes up so little traffic, think of it like this. I enter Lion's Arch, and send a guild chat saying so. Whoever is in the guild that is also in Lion's Arch sends a whisper to me saying what district they're in. I switch to that district.

Now automate that, and that is the addition.

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 04:58 PM // 16:58

That is YOU the person changing districts. Maybe you don't know automation. It sacrifices speed of the computer/interface, for speed/usability for the user. Always. If I automate that statement, as I already have told you. Then instead of YOU, just once clicking on change district after a guild message. We now have:

Entering Town
Search Entire Populus of Town for Guild Mates
If Guild Mate is in town, then search again for other guild mates.
If two guild mates are in same district, search again to make sure more are not in another district.
FINALLY FOUND THE DISTRICT WITH THE MOST GUILD MATES.
Send YOU to that district.

Hope I clarified a bit. This is obviously much more abusive than, Hey what distro you in? 4, brt.

Kopus Tol · May 20, 2005, 05:07 PM // 17:07

> Entering Town

OK.

> Search Entire Populus of Town for Guild Mates

Unnecessary. Search list of logged on Guild Mates to see who is in town.

> If Guild Mate is in town, then search again for other guild mates.

Unnecessary. Go straight to that district.

>If two guild mates are in same district, search again to make sure more are not in >another district.

Unnecessary. Why would two guild mates be in different districts?

> FINALLY FOUND THE DISTRICT WITH THE MOST GUILD MATES.

Unnecessary. See above.

> Send YOU to that district.

Way ahead of you.

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 05:11 PM // 17:11

Why on earth would they keep position in the guild roster? Again unneeded traffic. When you can just ask. All you've done is put more into the guild roster. Well then you can just pick the district that you see labelled in the roster, which that idea may have more than one implementation (i.e. guild members may be busy in a mission) so that one I may agree with simply for its multiple abilities. You have to check for other guild mates in case of concurrent log ons, in games bugs, guild mate zoning in/out at time of joining, etc.. Otherwise you may end up with other problems like infinite loops when there is a guild mate in a different district.

EDIT: Here is what I think might be a compromise:

Next to name in guild roster, say what town/district/mission/area Guild Mate is in.

Then when you travel, you just have to hit the right district.

EDIT AGAIN: You have to remember this game doesn't have "servers" as individuals. So just zapping a character between districts could be between servers, this can also lead to problems.

Kopus Tol · May 20, 2005, 05:17 PM // 17:17

> Why on earth would they keep position in the guild roster? Again unneeded traffic.

They wouldn't.

> When you can just ask.

This is the whole point. This is just asking. Except that the client asks and changes districts for you.

JohnCoke · May 20, 2005, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Agree to disagree (I honestly feel you dont have enough experience, but you may be right). One question, then how on earth does it search for guild members locations if its not clearly dictated in a structure such as the guild roster. You're kind of hazy on your implementation.

Kopus Tol · May 20, 2005, 05:32 PM // 17:32

Let's look at the current implementation.

"Hey what distro you in? 4, brt."

So you're using guild chat to ask where your guild mates are. Your guildmates use guild chat to respond to you. We agree that guild chat doesn't take up a lot of traffic.

So what we need is a way for one client to send a message to the clients of guild mates. It's exactly like guild chat, except that instead of the players talking to each other, the clients are. This must already exist, for the guild window to update when a member logs in or logs out.

So this also doesn't take up a lot of traffic.

So now for "Hey what distro you in? 4, brt.", instead of using guild chat, use the second, client to client chat.